Wednesday, May 30, 2012

Tangle of Need *Spoiler* Thread

*BIG GIANT SPOILER WARNING*

Comments - to see comments after #200, click on the [# of Comments] link at the bottom right of this post. It will bring up a pop up box showing comments 1-200. To see 201 onwards, click the [Newer/Newest] link up the top.

Hi all! Just a reminder to keep the comments on the other threads spoiler free, as lots of people are still waiting for their copies of Tangle of Need. 

However, you can discuss the book with spoilers in the comments to this post only. This is a space for fans to talk to one another - if you have questions specifically for me, shoot me an email. I'm way behind but hoping to catch up over the next few weeks, so be patient if you don't get a response straight away.

If you haven't yet read the book, and don't want to be spoiled, look away! I'll place a bookmark to this thread in the sidebar , so you'll be able to come back and join in the discussion once you have read the book. 

As always, please respect one another's opinions, even if you disagree. Happy discussing!

264 comments :

1 – 200 of 264   Newer›   Newest»
Anonymous said...

Last three pages were such a tease! What's going on with Ben and Marlee? It made me sad they weren't friends.

Delilah said...

Last page had me fighting with my Nook. I knew there had to be more, but stupid thing kep saying no.

Unknown said...

Delilah, me, too, except with my kindle. I got to the last page and kept trying to turn for more, but alas I was at 100% already. So sad! Must wait for so long for the next.

Anonymous said...

Of course the book should have been a lot longer. When can I preorder the next one??

As long as the name of the hero in the next book will start with a K I can wait (and no, I don't mean Kenji!). :D
I also really hope Vasic will get his own story, I felt so sorry for him.

Oh and I loved Hawke getting hungover. lol.

The only thing that did not really impress me much was Riaz/Adria's story. It wasn't bad, but I found myself wanting a few times to skip the passages where they played a role to read the rest.

Sarah B said...

I don't think kaleb's will be next. I'm pretty sure his will be the last in the series. I expect we'll have another wait for his like we did for Hawk. I think she'll move on to explore the arrows and Aden and Vasic will have some resolution.

I so wanted more too!

Anonymous said...

I agree with you Sarah B - I think Kaleb's story will be last. He is so intriguing. I used to think he was the ghost, now I'm leaning towards Vasic. It will be interesting to see what happens there. Loved the Riley-Mercy scene when he realizes she's pregnant. And Hawke's hangover was the absolute best. Oh, there is so much I loved! Can't wait till the next one. I'm counting down the days! : )

Anonymous said...

The intensity of the love between Adria and Riaz was amazing! Even without the mating bond those two are solid, and I wouldn't be surprised to see them grow into the bond as Dalton had discussed as a possibility. I am interested to see what happens with Alice and is Amara going to start something with her fellow researcher? Interesting....

Anonymous said...

I'm pretty sure Kaleb is the ghost (it is mentioned in different books the ghost is close to the net which would fit in, Vasic seems to hang on to his silence with his fingertips). Also loved the tidbit about Kaleb's double cardinal status, want more of that!

I don't think the next will be the last book, I remember reading somewhere that after this one there would be another 2-4 books until this part of the P/C series is finished.

Roxy said...

I squealed like a little girl when the read the bit that revealed Kaleb's dual cardinal status! Also, poor Vasic! I really want him to get his HEA, but things are starting to look grim for him :(

Kat, The FLuff said...

Vasic ... "le sigh"
Oh God! He´s so broken... But the way he protects Aden is just sweet.
He´s like a lost little boy.

But Aden didn´t really.. I mean REALLY say, they douln´t trust him?! WTF!
Nalini Singh.. on Saturday you will be pounced. I need an answer to that one.

And Kaleb *jaw drops*

Anonymous said...

Oh my gosh MERCY's pregnant?! I was waiting anxiously for the day to come!!

Sycorax said...

If I was the fanfic writing type, I would be off writing Aden/Vasic slash. I know they'll get their own books and be paired with lovely changeling or human women, but there is something about the two of them that gets to me...

Anonymous said...

I think Kaleb's will be one of the near books... also, no way that the publishing company will let this series end! I still love the way the Hawke/Sienna story was (in comparison to how Acheron was a major disappointment).

I wonder if Kaleb will need to make himself vulnerable to help with the girl he rescued, either to Sascha or Noor/Keenan. Ditto to everyone else that thought the book couldn't end there!

Agree with the Ben/Marlee situation, I wish we could jump into the future and see how they get together as grown-ups.

Aden couldn't trust Vasic to oversee groups of children, because he thought Vasic would kill the trainers if they hurt the kids, which says something about Vasic's moral code. I think Vasic needs a maternal female... maybe Mariska? Maybe Annie could help him (I think he was the one who rescued her after the crash).

Would love to see more of the following:
- Nikita interacting with Naya
- Ben & Marlee
- Black Sea
- some of the anchors
- some X Psy discovering that Sienna is stable and asking for help, or the Arrows asking for help for such a child
- more of Silver (and her clan), she's intriguing
- some of the more low-level psy or changelings, see how they are dealing with this upheaval, I loved that some Psy helped during Henry's attempt at SanFran

Basically, I just want more in this world! And can't wait to see who's next... betting its Kaleb or Vasic... something major has to happen to start the upheaval in the next arc.

Anonymous said...

oohh i loved the book, kinda went crazy reading though, didnt stop untill it was completely finished, the last three pages made me want to hunt somebody namely nalini to tell what happens lol.
I really want to know more kaleb and vasic and the ghost....and hawke and sienna.
cant wait for the next book!

KB/KT Grant said...

Kaleb and "her" is driving me batty! The next Psy book has to be Kaleb's based on the last page in Tangle of Need.

Now, who is "her"?

Anonymous said...

Time for wild guesses: approaching this logically with no emotions involved as any psy worth their salt would do (is impatience an emotion... nahhh). Logic dictates that Kaleb will end up with a woman who is not silent. In other words, he'll not end up with the "her" he just found (how would they work out emotions together, seems very improbable). I also do not think he will end up with a changeling; that would somehow involve him leaving the PsyNet and he's too much a part of that.

Add to that the fact that another unfinished story is that of Alice. Sooooo, my bets are on Kaleb/Alice (no idea how that would be possible in a practical way... K asks Judd for help with "her" and meets Alice?). If Kaleb is the Ghost he knows already about Alice, after all he found her.

Oh, who am I kidding, this is just nerve-wracking!

Sheena said...

I think the mating bond has been undermined, and I hope the next changeling couple has the bond...

I was very bummed that Sienna is on birth control....I know there is a lot up in the air, but I just really wanted Hawke to become a father...I hope the series does not end before they can safely have a baby...besides, children born of changelings are able to shift and I doubt there would be an X-Changeling...his genes should cancel out her X-marker, not to mention how rare the marker is anyway...they will be fine...please give Hawke a cub!!!!

I will say that given how it played out, I am satisfied enough with Riaz & Adria...so ok I guess

I loved Riley & Mercy in this book! I loved having so much page time for Vasic & Aden and the arrows,

I loved Kaleb and I looooved Hawke & Sienna as the back story! They were amazing as I knew they would be!

And Judd *faint*

Anonymous said...

I was very impressed by this book. Riaz just seemed OK to me in Play of Passion, not too exciting, but I fell in love with him once he started seriously pursuing Adria and refusing to take no for an answer. Because yeah, I understood where he was coming from but I was not too impressed by him in the start of the book when he was all tortured and angsty and rude to her. At that point, I was wondering why she wouldn't run off with Sam (a nice addition). But now they are one of my favorite couples.

My only quibble was that I thought that the first half of the book had too much Hawke/Sienna, which I thought didn't protect the main storyline, since it was rather intrusive. Other than that, I was delighted by this volume. And as a rule, you can never have enough of Judd. His fan club explanation was adorable, and a nice nod to his fans who must feel the same, i.e. everyone who reads the Psy/Changeling series.

I find it very interesting that Riaz and Adria didn't get the mating bond; I thought Kiss of Snow opened up that opportunity for them by showing that an uncompleted bond could be replaced by another. I'm fine with it though, I like how they chose each other instead. I also am gratified they didn't make Lisette out to be some awful, inferior person. It was pretty hilarious when she went crazy on her husband, and beat him with her shoe ;)

Oh, and for the longest time I thought that Kaleb was the Ghost, now I think it is someone else entirely, so that the Ghost nickname makes even more sense. And it might be just me, but I swear I would read a spin-off series of the crime-fighting Psy duo, Aden and Vasic? I swear it could even be on TV.

Anonymous said...

I liked the love story, but the rest of the book was even better. Kaleb - dual cardinal - didn't see that coming. The book ended a bit soon. Well, for definitions of soon that involve mental torture. Next year can't be soon enough

In the meantime I'm quietly hoping the next book will be an Alice/Vasic pairing. I have no idea how they could meet, but Alice knew Zaid. Maybe a connection that way. It would explain why Nalini is keeping silent.

Dorien

Jocelyn said...

How could this book end so soon! I want more, PLEASE! =)

I love the way this story followed not only the journey of Adria and Riaz but continued Hawke and Sienna's story as well.

Nalini, I make very excelent chocolate chip cookies and I am willing to make batches for you if you can get another book out this year. ;)

Looking forward to the next book and rereading this and every other book in this series.

Alice said...

The only bad thing about a new Psy/Changeling is waiting for the next one!

I loved the Hawke and Sienna parts, and the ending was such a cliffhanger! I really hope Kaleb's book is next, mainly because he's such an enigma, and I'm really interested to read a Psy/Psy pairing.

Thanks for writing such great books Ms. Singh!

Maritza said...

Okay first and foremost. I. Hate. Cliffhangers. They have turned me off so many series. But.....
Dang namit. Although I'm so angry about having to wait a year for the next installment- I'll be preordering when it does become available.
I liked the way the mating bond was handled. I like the way they DID NOT mate and how Lisette want made to be a bad person or weak spined.
I don't have proof but I feel like Vasic and Alice will pair up. I really wanted to read more about her.
I also think the person in the padded room is the lost f-psy I can't remember her name.

Anonymous said...

I absolutely love this series, and yes I blew through the book in one sitting. After I finally got some sleep, I re-read the book at a slower pace just to make sure I didn't miss anything.
What can I say? I thought that the book was fresh and new and given the length of the series that is an accomplishment. Nalini did a great job of not falling into a recipe for the book that a lot of other writers fall into. Which goes back to my opinion that she's one of the best there is out there.
I loved being able to get an inside look at Hawke and Sienna. While previously we got glimpses of other mated characters in the series, we didn't ever really get a look at how the relationship grows after the HEA, and now we do!
But mostly, I am completely on pins and needles about Kaleb...and oh can I pretty pretty please have more of Aden and Vasic!!! Kaleb has become one of my favorites; he's complex and mysterious with a twist of something dark. And what girl out there can resist a mysterious man?!
I've run through so many possibilities of who the Ghost is and who "her" is and what's gonna happen when the pooh really hits the fan...but alas, I know that the only thing I can do is sit back and wait for more.
Please Nalini....WRITE QUICKLY!!!

Lisette said...

Haven't had a chance to pick up the book yet (to be honest, I am a bit disappointed that the books are going to be more expensive, even the Kindle version costs more than a regular paperback would :(...I thought naively it was only Hawke's book that was going to be the hardcover price)

Found out from another Forum that Adria and Riaz don't have the bond and that really shocked me. Every book before this one has some kind of bond, so I'm not sure how this one can show a true bonding story when the couple can't feel on the inside what the other couples feel. To me, it's like there isn't a 'one and only' with them and what would happen if per chance Adria's true mate ever showed up?

Everyone seems to like the book though and with updates on the other characters, I still plan on reading it.

Anonymous said...

I REALLY enjoyed this book!! Once again, another brilliant, wonderfully written installment to the series.

I will say that I didn't love it like I did Kiss of Snow, which for me was almost perfect in the relationship aspect of the story. But it was definitely close. I would have loved to see more of Adria and Riaz ...I thought that even though their story was wonderful, their "face time" in the book was a little short. But the intensity of their relationship made up for it. And I could just eat Riaz up with a spoon!! I'm all for broody and dominant and I think Nalini did an excellent job combining the two aspects and still making him a bit of a jerk early on. I particularly loved Adria's "I deserve more" line ...that was perfect to show how broken she was after the disaster with Martin.

Hawke and Sienna ...what can I say. That wolf turns me into a puddle of goo ...it doesn't matter what he's doing. Loved the mating ceremony and his drunkenness with Riley. Loved the scene with all of the lieutenants before the ceremony and surprising him.

And I think I'm finally hooked on the actual war and ghost storylines. Before I sort of skimmed, but I'm vested now. Can't wait to go back and do a re-read of the series to see what I've missed.

Great book Nalini! Can't wait for the next one :D

Jennifer

Kate L said...

Maybe this forum is not the best for this, but what the heck. I have questions and I'm just going to throw them out there and see if anyone wants to discuss:

--What do you think is happening to the PsyNet? It is dying and/or being actively destroyed. So, what will the Psy do? What will happen to the NetMind/DarkMind? What you you think will happen? Will it be replaced? Transformed?

In this book, we learn a lot about the Arrows (like that they've been dropping out of the PsyNet forming their own micro-nets and staying off the radar). I agree with others who guess that Kaleb may not be the focus of the next book, and I think it'll be the Arrows and perhaps Alice. What does Aden want? What do the Arrows want?

Anonymous said...

oh no....why can I not the spoiler? or i can not go to the site.

Anonymous said...

I agree. If you cut their story out I don't feel that anyone would notice.
MK

Anonymous said...

I liked the book but I feel with all going on that Adria/Riaz would have made a better novella then an actual book. I agree with the pricing being a little ridiculous. I'm unsure if I'll be buying anymore books or just waiting and hoping the library picks it up.

Kaleb is killing me. I don't know who he's looking for. A past love? His mother? A girl that he plans to exploit to save the web? It's so hard to stop pondering the possibilities.

MK

Anonymous said...

There was much about Tangle that I really loved (Hawke/Sienna, Kaleb, Vasic, Aden, Henry Scott getting what was coming to him, etc.) I really enjoyed aspects of Riaz and Adria's relationship but I had hoped the mating rules would be more clearly explained and I feel more confused than ever.

If Hawke's mate died as a child and he could still open himself to mate with Sienna, I don't see why Riaz couldn't with Adria. Riaz' wolf adored Adria. Riaz the man adored Adroa. Nothing was holding him back, other than Lisette exists and he met Lisette before he saw Adria. That he couldn't but still fell in love with Adria also troubled me because it does seem to diminish the mating bond overall, and the 10 previous books, if it is possible to "get over" the mating bond and move on to someone else.

But, I also know that it has been consistently said that the woman has the final say in the mating dance. I've wondered for years what would happen if a woman rejected the bond (since the woman always has the final say). That's always been out there as a possibility from the earliest books and has been mentioned many times. In this case, Riaz and Lisette weren't even in the mating dance when Lisette basically "rejected" Riaz and then Riaz basically "rejected" her. It never seemed quite fair to me that if a woman said "no, I can live without you and don't want to mate", then the male would be prevented from ever finding happiness. So I'm guessing that it's possible to break a bond in it's earliest stages if both parties reject it. (Dalton basically tells Riaz of a situation he knew of too.) I can kind of go with that.

Maybe the answer is that there are general mating rules but there are inevitable variations as actions and emotions can't always be predicted? Maybe the mating rules are evolving? Maybe they were never immutable? If that was the case, then I wish this had been addressed in the book. (Did I miss it somewhere?)

Nalini, can you clear this up, please? It's driving me crazy lol!

Ingrid J said...

First things first...I love the Psy/Changeling books with a passion! I eagerly await each new book in the series, reading the book in one sitting! This book was more of a "catch up" on all the other stories that have come bfore it, and dont get me wrong, the Hawke/Sienna and Riley/Mercy updates were fantastic, but it seemed that Adria/Riaz didnt get enough "time" in this one...

Nalini, if you do indeed read these comments, do not think that I am criticizing your writing! I just felt that Adria/Riaz were cheated in this book. Every other changeling pairing had a mating bond formed, and it was such a spectacular thing, something magical, immense in feeling and quite frankly indescribable...and they didnt get that. Frankly, if the bond can be that wrong in picking a life partner, as it did with Lisette and Riaz, I cant see what the big fuss is about it anymore. Was there a reason for them to be cheated? Is this laying groundwork for another couple down the road???

I love books...really love books and probably reread books 200, 300 or sometimes 1000 times over. And Nalini's are no exception. This one, well, I will reread it definitely but probably just for the updates on the other couples because honestly the Riaz/Adria story makes me want to cry... there are enough things in life that are sad, and escaping into another world like the one Nalini has created while reading shouldnt be one of them...

Tabitha said...

Add me to 'Team Disappointed' about Riaz and Adria not mating. Their relationship really muddied the waters of mating and not in a good way. Either mating isn't as special as we were led to believe or their relationship and bond isn't comparable to mating. I don't think you can have it both ways and this book most definitely tried to have it both ways. I wanted to be happy for them, but I was left sad for what they won't have.

Anonymous said...

Was it ever spelled out why BlackSea wanted the alliance? I recall Hawke saying being informed of the "WHY" would be a pass/fail negotiation point, then they mention in passing that it was shared in the meeting -- but was the WHY ever revealed?

Also loved the Hangover scene, and of course Faith collapsed in laughter after forseeing Mercy's children. I would love to know what she saw. :D

Not twins *wink* that was hilarious when they caught up on the uptake.

Heidy. said...

I'm curious about Amara's, Vasic's, Alice's and Kaleb's stories. I very much like the way Nalini has to wrap up and tidy/involve a previous story with the next, thus I'm hoping she'll throw the bonding between Riaz & Adria into one of the next books. Assuming that kind of "fading/erasing" of the previous bonding urge would take time (if at all possible). So yes, hoping. I can't wait to have news of the next possible ones!

Ryan Collie said...

Hey maybe I read through too fast but what happened between Ben and Marlee?

Anonymous said...

I am diffinitly wondering why Riaz and Aria's bonding did not fall along the typical mating bond that has been in the others . Wondering where Nalini is going to take us after introducing us to another form of bonding. One closer to what we have as humans. LOVE the series and Nalini's brilliant

Anonymous said...

Okay in the last chapter there is a line when kaleb is in the net trying to locate her "No one knows they took something of his" at least no one alive. Is a big hint but what do you all think it is hinting at. A lost love and yes why did the black sea group decide the wanted an alliance even before the contacted Hawk's group??

Anonymous said...

I have been doing some thinking about what we know about this person Kaleb has been searching for. This is a particular fixation for me.
1. It is a She. We now know that for sure.
2. She is the owner of the star charm that Kaleb carries. ( I love how he is always playing with it)
3. He has known her for a long time and knew her very well.
4. She has been missing for about 7 years.
5. She is likely very powerful and/or important in some way, due to how extensively she has been concealed. Someone went to a lot of trouble to take and keep her.
6. I believe that it is safe to assume she is Psy, considering how she was concealed within the Net. However, I want to point out that she is not necessarily Silent. Her shields have been destroyed, so it is likely her conditioning is no longer intact, much like with Katya.

For the moment, I am holding to the theory that she is an F psy. Possibly Faith's cousin Sahara who went missing.

Anonymous said...

Okay in the last chapter there is a line when kaleb is in the net trying to locate her "No one knows they took something of his" at least no one alive. Is a big hint but what do you all think it is hinting at. A lost love and yes why did the black sea group decide the wanted an alliance even before the contacted Hawk's group?? I'm glad Hawk's group knows but as a reader I would have liked to know also. Loved the sweet scene in golden gate park I thought that explained the bond between Riaz and Adria different than atypical mating bond but still a bond. Please don't make us wait a year for the next in the series

Anonymous said...

I think what happened with Adria and Riaz is how he explained it at the end of the book,is how Nalini views it. Finding the bond is a gift and all changelings view it that way,however if you don't find it it's not the end of the world. The scene where Riaz explains the old couple and forces Adria to watch and disagree with him bring the whole mating/non-mating (lovers) I think full circle. Mating is intense and there is great love in that and a forever partner,but mating isn't the only way to express love and it is dosen't lessen love without a bond. Love is love no matter what and not needing the bond is harder than having it, it dosen't make a couple better or stronger. Yes in mating you have a connection but so do you without one, I think them chosing each other based on how they got to know one another was awesome and how in the end it was the heart that chose,nothing more. They didn't need the bond to reassure what they felt and their feeling were just as intense and real as anyonelse's. Adria and Riaz made a bond of their own and in the end in my opinion ended up being one of the best psy/changeling books! Thanks Nalini can't wait for Arhangel's Storm.

midnight said...

I read through this book in 5 hours. I was exhausted. I think I need to pace myself. Because now I need my next Nalini Singh fix.

I will say I went through a bit of sadness, being single, after reading this. Same thing with Hawke and Sienna. You know, it's like experiencing/watching/interacting with something where the characters really touch you, and you would like that for yourself. I want a changeling! Haha.

I too was confused/concerned about whether Adria/Riaz's relationship would be as strong without the mating bond. However, it seems more sweet to me because it's a choice, their choice. Could you not have a mate bond with someone that was just not a nice guy? And then you'd be stuck with him. I think some mate bonds just click. And some take time as people have been so wounded.

I wonder if there is a Kaleb/Alice connection. I also would like to see more of Dark River. I miss them. I want almost a full story of how Lucas and Sascha are doing. Faith and Vaughn too. I see much less of them.

Anonymous said...

Read the last 30 or so pages again, then tell me who you think the Ghost is and what you think about who Kaleb has found.

There's lots of doubt cast over what we as readers think we know in ToN

midnight said...

I think Kaleb as the ghost is too obvious. But maybe perfect. Does even Judd know who the ghost is? I need to go back and review. I don't think it's Vasic or Aden. Those two are sweethearts, on a separate note. It would actually nice if they get with a broken Psy. I'd like to a Psy-Psy relationship. That would be interesting. Maybe that's what Kaleb's would be?

Anonymous said...

I know a lot of people are upset about the lack of a mating bone - I can see where you're coming from. But for one thing, the book mentioned how Drew and Indy knew each other for years before the bond snapped into place. So who knows, Riaz and Adria could eventually mate. I'm pretty sure it was mentioned as a possibility.

But even if they don't, I don't think that what happened for them diminishes the "specialness" of the mating bond. Dalton could barely remember any cases where mates didn't accept the bond, so the majority of changelings who found their mate accepted them, showing how important the bond is. But I think that what made Riaz and Adria's story so beautiful was that they loved each other so much, they were willing to be together even without the bond. Even without that primal, instinctive pull, they still chose each other. I really liked that.

Okay, what else to I have to say. I love Kaleb, Vasic, and Aden. I love Hawke and Sienna cooking together. I love pupcubs. :)

-Sarah M.

midnight said...

@Sarah - I agree about Adria/Riaz. I thought it was so touching how he chose to be with her. I do wish their story was fleshed out a bit more. But I wouldn't want to remove any Hawke/Sienna scenes either.

Anonymous said...

Oh yeah, and someone earlier in the thread mentioned Annie, and how a Tk child saved her by lifting the train wreckage off her when she was a girl. They said it might've been Vasic, but I've always thought it was Kaleb, because I'm pretty sure she said he had cardinal eyes. I wonder if Annie and Kaleb will ever meet again, even if it's just for a page or so in his book. That would be awesome.

-Sarah M.

Anonymous said...

Thank you Ms. Singh for giving us more Sienna/ Hawk, cant ever have enough of them. They are up there with Darcy and Elizabeth as best romantic couple ever. I love the Psy civil war and all it's implications. I also missed the dark river cats this time. Can't wait for the next installment. A year is way to long!

Sara said...

I enjoyed that Riaz and Adria's story was different from the other changelings and they didn't have a mating bond.

Bonds of Justice is one of my favorite psy/changeling books and also was a little different from other stories. Sophia's link to psy net was handled differently than other psy characters.

I think the differences keep the story more suspenseful.

Christie Sanders said...

Loved the book, have loved all of them. Really enjoyed hearing about the other characters and continuing their storylines; building the overall storyline of the Psy/changeling world. Nalini did a great job of giving Riaz and Adria a great story and interspersing the interactions of the other characters. I don't feel anything or anyone was short changed. I thought for sure Kaleb was the Ghost but now I'm not sure. The only thing I'm sure of is that I don't want her to end the series. I love this world she has created. I hope that Kaleb, Vasic and Aden all get their own stories. I really feel for
them and want them to have a happen ending. I wonder what the deal is with Nikita and I want to know why Ben and Marlee are on the outs too. I'm just totally enamored with this whole world and hope she continues with it for a long, long time. Her Guild Hunter series is great too. I have to say she is probably my favorite author! Great job, Ms Singh!

Anonymous said...

It never said. Just that they had a falling out. It broke my heart.

MK

L. said...

okay, I just have to say I LOVE MERCY AND RILEY! That whole part of the story just made me incredibly happy. Now I really want to re-read their story.

But I have so many questions from this book. SO MANY LOOSE ENDS. I finished this book and was so frustrated. New book soon?!?!? PLEASE!

Anonymous said...

Is there a thread of Nalini Singh? Talking over comments is difficult. I know she mentioned it but did it ever come to life?

MK

RedButterfly said...

@Ingrid J, @Anonymous above Ingrid J, @Tabitha

You guys said most of the things I wanted to say

Add me to Team Disappointed too. Until the last page I was hoping the bond would form and when it didn't well I felt... CHEATED. I really hope that Nalini will show us down the road that these 2 developed the bond. Right now this is my least favorite couple and like Ingrid I'll probably re-read it only for the updates, don't know if I can read this sad relationship again.

IMO the bond is supposed to be this big, wonderful thing where you find the only person made for you, the perfect one for you and it should be able to beat everything else, the fact that Riaz gave up it (the bond, his MATE) to stay with Adria well... I don't swallow it. Sure Riaz/Adria relationship was beautiful, the things he did while courting her made me smile but at the same time my heart broke because no matter what he did or how many times he tells he loves her and she is the only one in my mind she still is second best, she is not the one his wolf wanted to have the bond with even if the wolf chose her in everything else and they will never have the bond and all the wonderful things the bond brings

This book too everything I knew about the bond and muddled it up, no, scratch that, it took it, ripped it apart and left it in a dump

I think Nalini wanted to show us that a couple who loved each other even without the bond could exist, I cant accept it even though it makes me sad for that couple that they would never have the bond, but the fact that Riaz already had the bond with someone else, had this possibility of a mate with someone else didn't work in this context (at least not for me), I would have prefered if he had ended up with Lisette and that Adria had foud her mate down the road, like she said she deserved more, and yes I agree with her

I LOVED all the side stories, especially the ones about Hawke/Sienna

Dena Celeste said...

I'm so glad that I'm not the only one who saw glimpses of Aden/Vasic possibility. I do recall Nalini confirming a very minor F/F pairing (in KoS) on Twitter, but I'd love to see more M/M, F/F, etc. Even in secondary or tertiary characters. ^_^

Things are heating up quickly now, it feels like. As if there are lots of loose ends that'll soon come together. At the same time, I feel sad at the idea of this series coming to a conclusion. I just want it to keep going and going and going...

The end of this book was torture! I kept pressing next and it wouldn't keep going. *pouts* I need the next one now please.

Dena Celeste said...

@RedButterfly - I can understand where you're coming from. This book wasn't quite like the others. I was sad for the lack of the mate bond, but remember, he didn't accept the mate bond with Lisette.

In KoS, with Hawke and Sienna, Hawke sensed the mating bond before, but didn't actually have the chance to accept it. He then had the mating bond again become a possibility with Sienna, which he did accept. I think that example shows that there can be more than one possibility with mate bond partners, but once accepted, one cannot accept the bond again.

At least, that's my theory.

Anonymous said...

I hope a future story that has a main character in a novella or full length book will not be M/M or F/F...don't get me wrong, as obviously there is nothing wrong with that, but having read this series with main heterosexual characters, I would prefer future books not to have a same sex pairing.

Anonymous said...

I agree. I have nothing against F/F and M/M pairings as secondary characters I would not want the main characters as such. It just wouldn't flow at all with how the author built her characters.

Dena Celeste said...

*smiles* Hence why I added "secondary or tertiary characters" for M/M or F/F. Because I just can't see anything other than M/F for main characters in this particular series.

Arlia said...

OMG, I hate cliffhangers. And yet... The best series ALWAYS have them. Maybe I have some sort of masochistic streak.
But I will seriously injure someone if I don't find out more about Kaleb and what is going on.

Regarding M/M, F/F pairings, I don't mind, as long as they're in the background. Many authors do that really well. Besides, there's a lot of hints of Aden and Vasic. :D Just saying.

I'm so glad this series keeps getting more refreshing and original. I hate it when authors just use the same old formula again and again.
I love all the character building and I'm so glad that, even though a couple's book is already out, they're not immediately relegated into the background and are just mentioned one or two times in the books. It's so interesting to see the mating develop beyond their own books, and how they come to define their relationship. :P

I loved the Adria and Riaz dynamic. How they had their own problems that they chose to solve and go for the relationship even if it seemed that nothing would come out of it.

I can't wait to read more about Nikita, Aden & Vasic, Anthony, Kaleb (especially), the two Netminds, Alice, Ben & Marlee, Toby, Kit, Kenji, BlackSea (that was a cliffhanger too—what was it that they needed help from SnowDancer from?) and all the others!

Arlia said...

I'm so confused about the girl Kaleb found. According to Anonymous, we know:
(This is what Anonymous posted)
1. It is a She. We now know that for sure.
2. She is the owner of the star charm that Kaleb carries. ( I love how he is always playing with it)
3. He has known her for a long time and knew her very well.
4. She has been missing for about 7 years.
5. She is likely very powerful and/or important in some way, due to how extensively she has been concealed. Someone went to a lot of trouble to take and keep her.
6. I believe that it is safe to assume she is Psy, considering how she was concealed within the Net. However, I want to point out that she is not necessarily Silent. Her shields have been destroyed, so it is likely her conditioning is no longer intact, much like with Katya.
(This is what Anonymous posted)

I'm just going to add a small tidbit to that. In the first early books, it's mentioned that Kaleb may have been an apprentice of Enrique's. I wonder what that means?

Anonymous said...

What is it with Ben and Marley? Sb please answer?

SB said...

Anyone want to fill me in on what happened with Ben and Marlee? I must have read too fast because I missed it...

Anonymous said...

In regards to Kaleb being Enrique's apprentice, this is true in several regards. Kaleb was assigned to Enrique for training in his TK abilities. Not unusual, since Enrique was a Cardinal TK too.
But... we know that Enrique was a sociopath and a serial killer, and he likely trained (or tried to train) Kaleb to be his apprentice in that regard as well. Nikita had Kaleb investigated and noticed odd gaps in his training record. Enrique likely started taking Kaleb with him when he captured and killed his victims.( I want to point out that at this time, Kaleb would have been a child and no match for Enrique. He was just as much a victim as those women) After learning this, Nikita believes that Kaleb is of the same cloth as Enrique. I dont think this is true, however. The Arrows investigated him as well, and found no evidence of sociopathy. Kaleb has certainly killed, but he is not a killer in the same way Enrique was.

Also, I want to throw this out there because it has been bothering me a little. In CBI, Nikita noticed odd gaps of 3 months time in Kaleb's training records. I need to go back and check if these gaps occured before or after Kaleb had a session with Enrique, but I believe that these gaps a times when he could have been training/spending time with the woman he has been searcing for. If no notes/records were kept of the time they spent together, no one would know that this woman could have been significant to Kaleb, unless they were there personally.

Anonymous said...

I want to mention, that it is consistently said that Kaleb is Silent, but there are little things that I have noticed that might suggest he is not as Silent as even he believes.
I believe that in BOJ, Kaleb wakes in the middle of the night and goes for a run, because he knows that he will not be able to sleep any more that night. Hmmm...I would venture to say he was dreaming, or having a nightmare more specifically. Except, that Psy who are silent are not supposed to dream.
Also, his habit of playing with the star charm he carries. It just strikes me as something that would not be something the truly silent would do, just as they would not attach so much meaning to an object.

Sammathuponnu said...

I wanna know what Black Sea's reason was.... I have a feeling its important to Kaleb's storyline!!!

And who has imprisoned Kaleb's girl?! Ming?! Or Someone else? Because Kaleb say's No one alive knew they had taken something of his... so it cant be Ming can it?

And WHO IS SHE???!!! Ms. Singh, This Cliffhanger is Just Plain Cruel!!! And its beneath you... It really is... Making us wait like this... *sniff sniff*

And Of course Kaleb is the Ghost, anything else would be Torture! And i agree that his book has got to be the last in the series, or at least the book where the Net breaks its Silence. And if that's true it cant be the next book. Which again means... we're in for a loooooong wait! *Sigh*

I really liked the book, but now Ms. Singh has made me a very grumpy fan!

Sammathuponnu

p.s - The book was great, in terms of the whole story line (but not like KOS where the relationship leaves you unable to focus on the story line at some points)I was rolling around and laughing when a drunk Riley boasts about giving Mercy pupcubs :D

Anonymous said...

I loved all the back stories -- I hate to lose sight of old characters, so it's great that they come back in. I love too that Nate and Walker are becoming friends, and that Jules and Roman are running around as cubs with Ben in the Den, it is those small snippets that really do it for me -- all behind the current story. Nalini -- keep it up!

Anonymous said...

It never said. Just that they had a falling out. She never said why.

MK

Hazatul said...

Theories.. theories.. I have two about Kaleb and The Ghost.

Kaleb: Could it be the swan girl that went missing, which caused him to go into a decline during his teen years? Could it be she was hidden to protect her from Enrique?

Coz she doesn't have shields and Enrique kinda did that to Brenna too but Bren survived coz she's a changeling and coz she's got stud muffin Judd ;-)

I don't think Kaleb's the Ghost but he could be.

The Ghost: Wild theory here. Could it be Zaid? Could it be he faked his own death, just like the other Arrows living in Venice, and is bringing down Silence due to his love for Alice. Alice mentioned him in a way that made me think they were in love.

Maybe he broke Silence for Alice. And he thinks he's lost her to the Council so he wants Silence to fall so that nobody has to be without their loved ones ever.

Read the TON ebook twice. Shall read it again many times over the weekend for more clues.

Nalini, I love your books but giving a huge hint like that at the end of a book is CRUEL, especially when we have to wait like another year for the next book. Aaaargh.

But thank u for sharing this wonderful fantasy world with us.

Anonymous said...

I finished a re-read and I still am confused about the mating rules so I hope Nalini will post some answers and clarify things.

I get that there has always been choice involved as the woman can choose to accept or reject the mate bond. That I get. I suppose this is an example of what happens in that scenario. The male has the ability to recover and move on with someone else (?)

I think the emphasis on Riaz being a lone wolf helped some the second time through and the knowledge that lone wolves are extremely protective and possessive in the extreme once they've chosen their woman, like he would behave similarly to a mate bonded male.

But bottom line is that I just so didn't like that he and Adria won't have that connection, not be able to check up on each other through the mate bond, figure out each other's feelings, feel that pulse of love coming through. It was just so obvious a contrast with the other couples in the book. Made me sad they won't have that.

Anonymous said...

I think many of the hints and signs point to the girl that Kaleb has been looking for (and now found) is Sahara NightStar, Faith's cousin who disappeared. The time frame seems to fit, he carries around a "star" and Kaleb's personal symbol is a star. As a likely F-Psy, she'd be incredibly valuable to someone as their own personal foreseer.

Anonymous said...

Michelle from Washington, DC here.
What page is it mentioned that Marlee/ Ben had a fallout? Thanks

Anonymous said...

Page 281

MK

RedButterfly said...

@Anonymous (below Hazatul) said

"But bottom line is that I just so didn't like that he and Adria won't have that connection, not be able to check up on each other through the mate bond, figure out each other's feelings, feel that pulse of love coming through. It was just so obvious a contrast with the other couples in the book. Made me sad they won't have that."

THAT was exactly my point my friend, it bothered me to no end that they will never have that, its exactly why I don't swallow the fact the Riaz gave it up with Lisette to stay with Adria - who he has no connection. Still hope that they will develope the mate bond in years to come (and that Nalini will show that).

But IMHO no matter how much he says that he loves her, that he doesn't need the connection and blah blah blah it will always stay in the back of their mind: "what is like to have the bond? Is it as good as they say?" and they will always be "jealous" that they don't have it, that they can't experience it while some/most od their friends have it.
Just like in KoS Hawke was jealous that Brenna was able to check up on Judd through the mate bond, the fact that Riaz/Adria won't have that makes me so sad.

And even though Nalini showed us that Riaz's wolf new that Adria had her heart closed it still isn't the same as having the bond, the dynamic between bonded mates is different no matter how much Nalini tried to say/show that it was the same.

Also I agree with the people that Riaz/Adria didn't have much face time, this book was about them they should have showed up more but then again the biggest part of me was glad for that, I don't know how much more of that excruciating relationship I could take

KateL said...

@Hazatul wonders if the Ghost could be one of the original Arrows (the original?), Zaid. While it's an intriguing theory, I think for that to be possible would break too many rules in Singh's world-building.

Alice has been in cryonic supension for 100 years or something like that. How could any of her contemporaries be alive in the world?

Terri said...

Goes without saying, but I'm going to say it anyway. Nalini, you're a world builder without peer. I primarily read fantasy and sci-fi, and this series could cross over into either of them. It's so much more than just a paranormal romance series! I loved this book, as I loved the others, and I LOVE how the stories and characters keep getting more and more complex. I will admit to being a tiny bit disappointed that Adria and Riaz didn't get their mating bond in the end, but like others have mentioned, Dalton has laid the groundwork for the possibility down the road. We can keep hoping.

As for the other characters, I have too much to say, so I'll stop now! I loved the back stories, HATED the cliffhanger, and CAN'T WAIT for the next installment. Nalini, you're my addiction... PLEASE, keep them coming!

Saiqa said...

Wow! Looks like I'm late to the party. Love how indepth everyone's comments are. I totally agree with the people who said Adria and Riaz were their least fave couple.Also agree with everyone who said they loved the Hawke/ sienna bits, Mercy and Rileys baby news and best of all Kaleb! My fantasy husband! Can't wait to read his story.

Anonymous said...

Kaleb's "HER" is AMARA!!

RedButterfly said...

@Saiqa

Kaleb in MINE lol but if you want we can share him, I can have him Monday, Wednesday and Friday and you can have him Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. Sunday will be his free time ROFL

I also LOVE the Riley/Mercy bits they had me laughing soooooooooo much and it was cute

Also I'm with the people who thinks the girl Kaleb found is Sahara (hope I wrote the name right). Ever since someone said that they thought she was the one he was searching for it has been ingrained on my mind. Hope someone will help with the girl's mind, maybe Noor and Keenan.
I also thought at the beginning that Kaleb/girl will be a romantic pair but now I'm not so sure, maybe not.

As for the m/m couple, I would LOVE if a pair were the main couple. I love m/m stories so I'm okay with all that. I was thinking maybe Aden/Vasic, but if not I think it would be fun if Vasic and Aden ended up with a leopard or wolf woman.

The Ghost: my mind is not made up about him. Though it was Kaleb and then thought it was Vasic. Now I'm not sure anymore, though my mind is pretty much fixed on Kaleb.

HATED the cliffhanger, it was killer *bad Nalini*. When I came to that part I was like: "OMG we are going to discover now who she is, next page please. WHAT?! NO NEXT PAGE? NOOOOOO" *DIE*
Hope in the next installment you will reveal who she is.

And talking about the next installment I think (more like hoping) it's going to be VASIC. *squee*

Anonymous said...

Anyone want to fill me in on what happened with Ben and Marlee?
I must have read too fast because I missed it...

Anonymous said...

Nalini, you are an awesome writer and I love your work BUT Why oh why was there not a mating bond??? I know before the book came out, the backstory was that Riaz's mate was with someone else and all, but just as in KOS, I naturally assumed that there would be a way around the mating bond and Riaz and Adria would have the 'real' mating bond. This was a big disappointment to me, quite honestly. All the previous books involving Changelings had a mating bond, and even the stories with human/Psy had some kind of psychic bond as well. I will never truly believe that Riaz and Adria are each other's one and only because of all the past books stating how special a mating bond is, etc, etc, etc

P.S. - I completely understand the need to make a living obviously, but why the big price jump? $7.99 was perfectly reasonable for a paperback, but $25.00 for a hardback with no option to get a paperback is such a big difference, especially when the word count is the same. I find this a big disregard for readers when authors do this.

I know I sound like a hater, but as a longtime reader of the series, I am going to be honest in my opinions and I think it would be a disservice to authors for readers to not express how they feel.

Anonymous said...

I just want to say, that it is the publisher's decision to publish in hardback or not. It also shows confidence in the author and the author's popularity to take a series to hardback. I was disappointed in the price jump too, but I knew for a while that it was going to happen, as awesome as this series is. Also, the ereader prices are a bit more reasonable. Just saying.

Anonymous said...

I want to see more of Anthony and Nikita. Definitely something going on there. I would really like to see their relationship develop more. Not a full book, but maybe a novella or like how she managed Walker and Lara's relationship, as part of a larger novel.

Anonymous said...

I love the Psy/Changeling series but i didn't like the fact that Riaz ended up with Adria.Their relationship is too ambiguous for their environment where mated pairs are the norm.
Is it possible that Kaleb's 'her' is a blood relation?
I know that doesn't follow Nalini's pattern(childhood sweethearts Tally and Clay in Mine to Possess) but it is an option considering that Kaleb is unlikely going to be the next story told.

Anonymous said...

i kinda want vasic and amara as a couple... and i never thought about the possibility of kaleb and alice, but I'm kinda like the idea :D waiting for the next book, so looong til then :'(

Anonymous said...

I think it be an interesting twist that kaleb finds a relative. It seems the author is trying to step out of the norm. ( lack of mating bond and all) so it could happen. I was thinking along the same lines. Maybe it's his mother or something like that. I mean he seems obsessive with it so it could go to breaking his silence for love or family. I dunno. It's fun to make up things in my mind then read to see how it really turns out.

Tabitha said...

Vasic and Amara? The suicidal guy and the sociopath? Match made in the Psy(ch) Ward!

Anonymous said...

Why do people try to pair up alice with someone? Isn't she like a hundred years old?

Ragdog said...

I thought of the Kaleb and Alice connection. She woke up at the same time he found his connection to the one he was looking for. But, not sure on that one. I was hoping for a pregnancy, between either Judd and Brenna or Riley and Mercy. So, I got one wish and multiples. Can not wait to see what they are. And, I thought Judd was so funny. Need more stories with Darkriver.

Anonymous said...

Judd and Brenna's baby would be interesting. I'm glad Mercy and Riley are going to have pupcubs. Riley seems to need to be in a father role. As for Kaleb and Alice. I think the author is trying to give us false trails so when we read the book later we'll be surprised its not what we thought.

Is it just me or does ToN seem like its a stolen bits of other Singh books compiled into one with different names? The Adria/Raiz kinda felt like it was just copy pasted from her other books with their names inserted. It felt disjointed and very awkward at times. I never got that warm or happy feeling. I kinda felt cheated that I paid so much money for a book that was all over the place. Everything in the book with Adria and Riaz felt forced. She tried to go a new way but it just flopped for me especially for 12 bucks.

fallenkitsune said...

I just finished the book and i really liked it, i can tell by the fact that i cannot wait to find out who Kaleb is looking for. I do think Riaz and Adria made an unlikely pair at the beginning but i think it works well by the end of the book.

SB said...

Personally, I'd like to see Vasic with a changling or human - someone that understands emotions and can help him heal. And I think some time in one of the changling packs would be good for him.

Either way, I'm really excited for his story.

Tabitha said...

Vasic definitely needs some Changeling love. I think a maternal would suit his just fine. A dominant doesn't seem necessary just warmth and love. Am I the only one who wanted to hug him in this book?

Anonymous said...

Nope. He really got to me. He might out do Kaleb in my heart.

Anonymous said...

Love Vasic. He's so broken but holding it together just barely. I love how he and Aden are so concerned about the little Arrow children. I keep thinking that maybe it'll be Walker and Judd and Sienna that will help him heal, so let's get him to the SD den so he can find a beautiful changeling female (Mariska maybe?) of his own!!

Anonymous said...

Add me to Team Disapponied re Adria/Riaz and re the mate/mating bond..I don't think it was a satisfying HEA, even if he does love Adria there's a part of him that still feels that primal tug towards Lisette..whilst Adria will be 100% his..she deserves someone that doesn't feel anything for anyone else. It also made out that Lisette wasn't right for Riaz..so why was were they mates..does that mean some of the previos couples were also not right for each other but because of the pull they felt through the mating bond and the love that went hand in hand they could have ended up with the wrong person..it makes it seem that they have no choice who they mate is and their forced to feel that way..it's just not romantic.
I liked H/S, M/R, Kaleb and the arrows though.

Anonymous said...

I really like this book. It doesn't matter to me that Adria and Riaz did not have the mating bond. I think it is more special that they chose to be with each other. What a horrible thing to be bonded to someone who was in love with someone else and that is what Riaz and Lisette would have had. I think he moved on once he realized she really loved her husband. Nalini never said that all couples who find their mates would actually have a mating bond with them. Seems timing has to be right and interest on both sides. Nate and Tamsyn knew they were mates, but he fought it and didn't realize until later how close he had come to losing her.

Jillian said...

I loved the book and will always love anything Nalini writes . BUT saying that I was a little disappointed with the fact that Adria & Riaz's story seemed a little short . I loved the secondary stories but really it seemed the secondary stories were overtaking the romance between Adria & Riaz .. I'm not one of the ppl that are disappointed w/the whole mating thing . I think that they are going to grow into the mating and in a future book we will see
that .. at least that's what I hope !
I was hoping to see more of Walker and Lara , maybe in the next book ?
I love everything about this world of changlings,Psy, and humans . I wish I lived in this world as I'm sure others do !
Nalini if you are reading these comments I just have to say "How could you leave us with that last line in the book ?!!" I was reading my Nook and kept trying to go to the next page and after about 4-5 tries I was like "OMG" how could she do this to us ?!!! Auuggggg !

Jillian said...

I loved the book and will always love anything Nalini writes . BUT saying that I was a little disappointed with the fact that Adria & Riaz's story seemed a little short . I loved the secondary stories but really it seemed the secondary stories were overtaking the romance between Adria & Riaz .. I'm not one of the ppl that are disappointed w/the whole mating thing . I think that they are going to grow into the mating and in a future book we will see
that .. at least that's what I hope !
I was hoping to see more of Walker and Lara , maybe in the next book ?
I love everything about this world of changlings,Psy, and humans . I wish I lived in this world as I'm sure others do !
Nalini if you are reading these comments I just have to say "How could you leave us with that last line in the book ?!!" I was reading my Nook and kept trying to go to the next page and after about 4-5 tries I was like "OMG" how could she do this to us ?!!! Auuggggg !

Ronel said...

First of all, I love pupcubs!!! Riley is too sweet! Who wants to bet Faith was laughing because she saw that some of the babies will be wolves and some leopards i.e. neither species will come out dominant?

Although I enjoyed the deepening of Hawke and Sienna's relationship, I felt they had too much time relative to Adria and Riaz, so the book missed a bit of focus for me. I did however love reading about Aden and Vasic - definitely time for a HEA for Vasic.

I found Adria and Riaz's story great. Personally I would have been disappointed if they did form a mating bond already - the idea that a changeling can force a bond with choice would make the bond less special. I figure it needs a combination of the right people, the right time and an emotional connection - Lisette couldn't give the emotional connection so she never entered the mating dance with Riaz. The pain of that experience fundamentally changed Riaz so that over time he became a worse match for Lisette and a better match for Adria, who also knows the pain of rejection from someone who should have loved her. I'm sure that as their relationship develops this will become increasingly true until in a future book, at the right time, the bond will develop for them.

Regarding the "her" that Kaleb found, my guess is that she was also trained by Enrique and wherever Kaleb went during those unexplained absences in his training record, she was there too. So the reason no-one alive knows she was taken from him is because Enrique imprisoned her, Enrique is now dead and only the 3 of them know what happened during those "missing" months. I also don't think she is a lover because that would mean he has broken silence badly, plus he needs a non-Psy to help him with his emotions ;) I also don't see how she could be the missing F-Psy - the F-Psy are too well protected for her to be the person that Kaleb knows best in the world. I'm going with a twin sister!!

Can't wait for the next book!

Cassie said...

Ronel, you could be some sort of evil genius (or I'm still a little bleary-eyed from reading all last night but whatever I'm going with you being a genius). Kaleb having a twin makes more than a little sense.

Twins and the PsyNet have been a major theme of the entire series.

I have to sit somewhere quietly for a while. My head is spinning with this thought.

Anonymous said...

I loved every aspect of Nalini weaved a brilliant pattern of interconncted charcaters and stories. Featuring a ordinay lov story added to the story arc.

I want to see Kaleb, Vasic, and Aden get their own separae stories but absolutely no M/M storyline. That is where I would get off the Psy-Changeling bus forever. I hope Nalini keeps with the integrity of this amazing series and does not does not make the mistake of caving into fan pressure, a la JR Ward, and ruin a wonderful series to just to gain a few mre ducats.

Anonymous said...

WOW! I loved this book! I loved Riaz and Adria's story; how their relationship evolved and transformed. I was impressed by how Nalini was able to weave all the various characters and tell a riveting story. I enjoyed seeing the deepening of Hawke and Sienna's relation as well as the getting to see more facets of the Arrows and Kaleb.

This book feels like it was pivotal to what is coming next. Who is the Ghost, I feel like I should know, but the clues are so fleeting. I can't wait to see what Alice reveals to the Arrows about Ziad and this original mission. I am looking forward to seeing how Riaz and Adria grow - I feel like their mating bond will come into play as she starts to own her Maternal Dominant energy. I am also very curious about Kaleb and what his end game is! As for Vasic and Aden, how can we not love them.... The Arrows in Venice - it will be interesting to see what happens between them and the Human Alliance. I keep wondering what will have to the Forgotten - I am waiting to hear more about them. Then there is Ming - will Sienna and Hawke work with Judd and the Arrows? What is the connection between Vasic and Sienna - there was a line in this book that really peaked my interest about that connection. It feels like she has something to share with him....

What an amazing world. I know we have to wait a long time for the next book, but I can't wait. I find that Nalini weaves an amazing story. I love it! Here is the next chapter....

Anonymous said...

WOW! I loved this book! I loved Riaz and Adria's story; how their relationship evolved and transformed. I was impressed by how Nalini was able to weave all the various characters and tell a riveting story. I enjoyed seeing the deepening of Hawke and Sienna's relation as well as the getting to see more facets of the Arrows and Kaleb.

This book feels like it was pivotal to what is coming next. Who is the Ghost, I feel like I should know, but the clues are so fleeting. I can't wait to see what Alice reveals to the Arrows about Ziad and this original mission. I am looking forward to seeing how Riaz and Adria grow - I feel like their mating bond will come into play as she starts to own her Maternal Dominant energy. I am also very curious about Kaleb and what his end game is! As for Vasic and Aden, how can we not love them.... The Arrows in Venice - it will be interesting to see what happens between them and the Human Alliance. I keep wondering what will have to the Forgotten - I am waiting to hear more about them. Then there is Ming - will Sienna and Hawke work with Judd and the Arrows? What is the connection between Vasic and Sienna - there was a line in this book that really peaked my interest about that connection. It feels like she has something to share with him....

What an amazing world. I know we have to wait a long time for the next book, but I can't wait. I find that Nalini weaves an amazing story. I love it! Here is the next chapter....

Anonymous said...

Ok about Aden's comment about Vasic...he was not saying that they could not trust him to be loyal. He was saying than when the war is over and the net stable, they will not be able to stop him from taking his own life. I agree with someone elses comment...I think he needs a maternal or sub. Brenna's tech friend M. would be perfect. Also if he were mated he would never hurt himself because it would hurt his mate. He would never hurt a mate.

Anonymous said...

Stayed up all night but it was worth it!! Nalini Singh *standing ovation*... I'm simply amazed by the way your characters have developed and there are so many possibilities its driving everyone insane!!

I loved the Riaz/Adria story because it touches upon the fact that you can have a powerful bonding with someone without it being a changeling one. And the cliff-hanger is driving me crazy, can't wait for the mysterious Kaleb's story:)

There are so many intriguing side characters like the Arrows, Amara, Alice, Silver, the SD lieutenants and hints of a relationship between Nikita and Anthony. Hopefully the brilliant Ms Singh gets to pursue the story of these characters as well. I love this series and really don't wand to see it end soon!

Anonymous said...

Loved it! Loved Riaz and Adria. I hope they form a mating bond in the next book. Absolutely no M / M or F / F.

Sandy

Elise said...

I really enjoyed ToN. Was a bit unsure how I'd feel about Adria and Riaz ending up with/without a mate bond and I'm actually really happy with the way things turned out. I know some people feel like the whole idea of mates has been turned on its head but it worked for me and also helped me understand Hawke and Sienna a bit better...whose relationship I really loved seeing in action in this book. They make a really awesome couple.

Actually the amount of time we got to spend with all the chars was lovely. I always want to see more of previous couple and I think this was the book for that especially considering this arc only has a couple more books to go? Plus Mercy and Riley just make me grin.

Ugh I thought I was firmly in the Kaleb as the Ghost camp but now I'm really not so sure and I don't even know why my opinion has changed.

So, guesses on who the next book will be about? I'm hoping for a Psy centered book since the PsyNet is crumbling and we've spent a lot of time with the SnowDancers.

Anonymous said...

I have to say the lack of the bond upset me a lil, but then reread the last scene and realized that they do have it...just not as I had come to expect...their bond is just as rich and wonderful as any of the others and commitment and love is just as true...after what they had both experienced I think if they had bonded it would have deminished what they and their WOLVES had both been through...I can see them bonding in the future after a few more scars have healed...I think for them maing the commiment to be together and love and heal was right for them...and where they r in their healing and relantionship........

And they idea of Kaleb with a twin...or maybe even a changling who he loved that they had tried brain washing so to speak maybe one they damaged but not as they had previously...and they r studing her for the why....


Thank you for the great read...
Wildcat_jay30

Dena Celeste said...

Aah, I do love these books. I finished re-reading the series again before ToN came out, just so I'd be all caught up. It was also a good distraction at this time.

Watching all the theories being come up with is fun! And thought provoking...hm. So many ideas! I look forward to seeing more of Nikita and Anthony. And who did Kaleb find? It's been driving me mad for most of the series, this search of his, more than almost any other part besides who The Ghost is.

Newnet said...

I think the person Kaleb finds at the end is Faith's missing cousin. Her mind is fractured and she was hidden behind so much security which leads me to think Anthony was hiding her until he could find a way to help her. Can't wait to see how that plays out.

Anonymous said...

I like your reasoning!

Anonymous said...

Interesting theories!

Eva said...

This whole Kaleb-Her-Thing irritate me a bit... - Why does Kaleb call her his quarry? This don`t sound very romantic to me and I´m not sure if I want to be Kalebs "quarry". So far it sounds for me more like he had learned a lot about her through a stake-out or monitoring. I fear almost that he will use her for his own purpose (Approx. the poor thing will be kidnapped from one monster to the next).

Otherwise he´s very obsessed with his search, to it could be possible that, during all this years, there has developed a kind of bond (at least at his side).

Any other ideas?

Lilliblu said...

I loved the book. I believe Riaz and Adria will eventually mate. It will just take time. Even if that never happens they will never stop loving each other. We have been told time and time again that the woman has to except the mating bond. Riaz and Lissette never even entered the mating dance. She never carried his scent. Her heart was already taken. Riaz and his wolf grieved for what could have been. Then this wounded man met and became attracted to this wounded woman. There relationship quickly became more than physical. They opened up to each other and shared their pain. Friendship, trust, caring, and love soon followed. They "bonded". Two broken people/wolves healing and finding love.

I think Kaleb's "her" is Sahara, Faith's cousin.

I also think that Sienna will be implanted with the chip to prevent Ming from entering her mind. Judd Walker and the other Psy in the packs may have it done as well.

I believe Amara will continue to improve and my find real happiness. i would enjoy that story.

No M/M or F/F main stories please. I just have no interest in them. Aden and Vasic just seem like best friends/brothers to me. They are like Hawk and Riley or Lucas and Dorian.

Lilliblu said...

Eva I don't think I'd mind being Kaleb's object of pursuit. :)

Lillblu said...

I forgot to add that I would love it if Nikita and Anthony became an item.

Dena Celeste said...

Never fear Lilliblu, I doubt you have to worry about seeing Aden/Vasic in the books, or really any M/M or F/F besides in passing about minor characters. ^_^ When it was brought up above, it was more along the lines of how fanfic writers use any hint of possibility to fuel inspiration. *grins* It tends to make waiting for the next book easier.

Oooh, I can't wait to see what becomes of Nikita and Anthony. They've had such interesting reactions to their children breaking from the Net! From what I can see in the books, Nikita appears to be more coldly silent than he is. I wonder how that would work, and what Nikita is like when not Silent. Anthony seems to have a bit more warmth, even if it's just in those small moments we catch when he meets with Faith or when we see from his point of view.

Anonymous said...

If the woman Kaleb was searching for is Sahara, I doubt that it is Anthony who has been holding her. My reasoning behind this is how she has been treated. Anthony understands that F psy need special surroundings, that it helps them to be able to go outside and be in a calm, natural enviornment. The woman Kaleb found was being held in a padded cell with no natural light. Also, if she just went crazy, why would Anthony need to go to such lengths to hide her? She is part of his psyclan and he has a right and responsibility to care for her.

Tabitha said...

I wouldn't mind an M/M relationship, just not Aden and Vasic. Those two aren't going to be healed by another Psy, male or female. Their relationship is that of best friends and brothers, even though they may not recognize their relationship as that.

I would LOVE to see Anthony breakaway some of that cold exterior of Nikita's. A hot roll in the sack would warm her a bit!

Dena Celeste said...

I wouldn't mind either, honestly. I'd love to see an M/M relationship, or even the odd triad mating, but the books thus far have the majority of main characters leaning in a heterosexual direction. So I don't expect it to happen in this series. Plus, the majority of people posting on here seem rather averse to the idea. Expanding that to represent her total fan base...probably most want this to go on as it has been, relationship-wise.

Oh, heck yeah! Hehe, I'd be curious to read a sex scene between Anthony and Nikita. I'd love to see inside of their heads more. Darn it, so many characters I adore and want to see get mated/paired/bonded/whatever. These books could go on forever! (Please? Pretty please?)

RedButterfly said...

@Tabitha said

"I would LOVE to see Anthony breakaway some of that cold exterior of Nikita's. A hot roll in the sack would warm her a bit!"

OMG I'm ROFLMAO XD Never thought about Nikita and Anthony together, I always wanted them to break silence and find someone but never passed my mind that they should have a "hot roll in the sack"

"I wouldn't mind an M/M relationship, just not Aden and Vasic. Those two aren't going to be healed by another Psy, male or female. Their relationship is that of best friends and brothers, even though they may not recognize their relationship as that."

Even though I would love to see Aden/Vasic together (I let my imagination run off) I agree with you that for both to break silence it'll have to be a changeling or a human. I'm hoping that their partner will be changeling though

Anonymous said...

I so agree with that one lol

Melissa R. said...

I had just spent the last week before ToN's release re-reading and re-reading Hawk and Sienna's book so it was fresh on my mind. I LOVED this book, but like most of you, I loved it for the updates on the other characters from previous books. Adria and Riaz's story was good to but I was more interested in the others. I agree with one of the previous posters-I think Kaleb's quarry is his twin sister, taken from him when he was younger. Would also love to see him hook up with Alice. And he is absolutely the ghost. Has to be him....or is it Anthony? Hmmmm...
And no m/m or f/f please. Although I sometimes read stories with m/m, I think it would take away from this amazing series and when I'm reading Nalini's stories I'm looking for the HEA m/f.

Anonymous said...

Loved the book. Loved Hawke and Sienna. I hope Riaz and Adria get to have their mating bond. I think Kaleb is looking for Sahara. It seemed like Riaz loved Adria, but he still felt the tug of the mating bond for his mate. No m/m f/f please.

Marie

Anonymous said...

I felt so bad for Adria. It seemed like she was second and not Riaz's true love. She deserves to be with someone where there is a mating bond. I really felt rather sad. I still loved it, but I was just sad. I hope Nalini will surprise us and let them become true mates in the next book.

I also do not want a M/M F/F relationship. I like to read M/F HEA. So Nalini if you read this, please do not pair Aden and Vasic together, I see them more as friends.

Anonymous said...

They keep getting better please don't end this series I beg you waiting a year will kill me as it almost did last time I need more please I am so happy that LOVE is sometimes stronger than NATURE as special as the bond is I am happy to see love matters as well thank you m/m f/f is still love I think this author can make them as beautiful and wonderful as all her other books in this series...I am trying the gaurdian series again have had trouble getting into them but I know that once I do they will be good because you could only produce great books thank you for sharing your wonderous world

Shannan said...

Theory on Kaleb and mysterious 'her'...

I think she is the changeling that was supposed to have died during Kaleb's internship with Enrique. I think Enrique did experiments on her just like he did with Brenna. Because of the experiments she needs feedback or she will die (just like Brenna). So rather than have a test subject die Enrique jacked her into the Net but had to put the shields around her because she could not shield herself.

Knowing that Kaleb was getting close to the test subject (remember he was interning with Enrique at the time) Enrique faked her death. Kaleb did not believe him so he has been searching all this time for her.

This would work out well because there are two things that Kaleb needs in my option. He needs to have a reason to protect the Net. If he does not have someone jacked in that he cares about he may just say '*&#@ it' and destroy the Net. He also could use a changeling to soften him up and smooth those wonderfully jagged edges. This way he gets both! What do you think? Anyone else on board?

Anonymous said...

Nalini, loved loved the book. Have to admit I too wished there would have been a mating bond. Wonder what happened to Ben and Marlee. Loved Hawke and Sienna. I think that Riaz and Adria will form a mating bond. I would loved to have seen Kit and Hawke getting jealous the way Hawke use to make Lucas feel. I too do not want a mm or ff relationship. Please keep this series going.
I think Kaleb is looking for Sahara and that he is the ghost.
Janelle

Laney said...

I really looooove this book. The entire series keeps getting better with each new entry. I love the richness, diversity, and sheer brilliance of this world wonderfully crafted by Nalini. These amazing stories with their provocative characters always evoke strong emotions - positive or negative - and stir up great conversations. Adria and Riaz are great together and I totally get their HEA without a mating bond.

This book was unique though because so many tantalizing things were left unsaid, more so I think than in previous books, and we have to wait for future books for the answers. But I think more clues were also given.

Shannan, I like the way you think. I always knew that Kaleb was looking for a female - I thought it was Sahara - but now you have me thinking it just might be the female changeling from his days with Enrique.

Also, there is another candidate for the Ghost that I have not ever seen mentioned. From the beginning I thought that Marshall, the councilor that was "killed" in the explosion, was a good candidate for the Ghost. The assassination of Marshall occurred out of the blue - I always felt other councilors made better targets for elimination. Also, if Marshall is the Ghost his "death" would have given him more freedom to continue his activities without so many eyes / minds watching him and it allowed for Anthony, another rebel, to ascend to the council. Remember that a body was not found, due to the explosion only enough tissue for DNA verification was retrieved. And considering that everyone's favorite PSY family - the Laurens - had been assumed dead when they were really alive it makes sense for Marshall to fake his own death. In fact in ToN we've learned about others whose deaths have been faked. Look at how Vasquez amputated his own finger so that his death could be verified with DNA. Hmmm, could that possibly be what Marshall did?? Whatever the reality, an interesting case can be made for Marshall being the Ghost. But after reading ToN I may have another candidate for the Ghost. I need to verify some info in the other books first before I say anything.

Wow, the bottom line is I’m like everyone else. I am eagerly looking forward to the next book. Please hurry Nalini, we need to find out what happens next.

Anonymous said...

First of all, thank you for tangle of need! Honestly, I thought it was the most shocking and heartfelt books in your series. I also love that you had m/m or f/f relationships in your series, I thought they were beautiful and well done.

Tangle of need was such a shocker, and I loved Adria and Riaz's turmoils. Emil was a character I also enjoyed.

Don't ever stop writing this series! You are officially my favorite author, right before JK Rowling.

p.s.s I also LOVED Hawke and Sienna's POVs. Absolutely wonderful talent you have!

Anonymous said...
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Anonymous said...

Loved the book! Can't wait for the next one! I wonder if we will know more about Alice Eldridge... she is interesting....I wish she would find love, maybe with one of the lieutenants, probably Alexei, since he is returning to the den.... I would love to read more about Alexei.

I still think Kaleb is the Ghost, but we need to wait to see if the Ghost is someone else. And I think the girl Kaleb found is Sahara.

I loved Hawke and Sienna's scenes and can't wait to see if the Operation Ming is a Dead Man Walking is a sucess!

Maggie.

Sheena said...

I am not on board with Aden/Vasic as a couple. I think they have a strong bromance kind of bond where they are loyal to one another and are friends in the purest sense of the word. I never got any m/m vibes from them at all. As a matter of fact Vasic says (to himself) a few times that Aden could still have a life- and this is after watching Judd with his pack...

Eva said...

@Lilliblu: LOL...I see!

Poor Vasic. He seems so lost without future. "Haunted grey eyes" - OMG. Now I can only hope that Nalini will find a way to give him some peace (Without killing him). ... Really, I wouldn`t mind to be his personal shrink:-).

Ming was wonderful evil. Nalini would be a gread thriller author, too. And the Sienna-chip-concideration would hit Hawke`s greatest fear. (First his father, then his mate.) I´m almost relieved that Ming droped this possibility.

Maryadine said...

I would love to see Nikkita and Anthony get together offically. I was wondering. If the woman was Judd,s sister Kristen. I don't know about timing but since a lot of supposedly dead Psy are still alive it's possible. Also, the ghost is Kaleb.

As for Adria and Riaz their story was ok, but I was done wait Riaz after he was rude in the beginning of the book. Their missing mating bond is appropriate, but also not necessary to finding true love.

I loved seeing everyone especially Judd and Brenna/ Mercy & Rielly / hawke & Sienna. I missed seeing lucas & sachsa together.

Maryadine said...

I would love to see Nikkita and Anthony get together offically. I was wondering. If the woman was Judd,s sister Kristen. I don't know about timing but since a lot of supposedly dead Psy are still alive it's possible. Also, the ghost is Kaleb.

As for Adria and Riaz their story was ok, but I was done wait Riaz after he was rude in the beginning of the book. Their missing mating bond is appropriate, but also not necessary to finding true love.

I loved seeing everyone especially Judd and Brenna/ Mercy & Rielly / hawke & Sienna. I missed seeing lucas & sachsa together.

Tabitha said...
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lia said...

So I'm one of the ones who thought Hawke and Sienna never should have had the mating bond (yes, go ahead and ready the firing squad). I'm not going to go into why, aside from the fact that the previous rules of Nalini's world lead me to believe that there was only one potential mate out there in the world for you. Because of this, I didn't mind Riaz and Adria not having the mating bond. I agree with those who mentioned Adria might feel second best and Riaz might regret never being able to feel what a mating felt like, but I liked that they chose each other and stuck to their choice. And technically there's potential for Adria to find her mate and then they'll have to make the same choice all over again.

I wish Riaz and Adria had more face-time in this novel. While it was great seeing many of the old wolf couples again, the constant flipping of narration really bothered me, especially in the beginning - I wanted to know more about Riaz and Adria! Count me in the club that would have been find with less Hawke/Sienna and Mercy/Riley... and even less Kaleb (blasphemy, I know).

As for Kaleb's search, someone above mentioned a changeling that was supposed to have died during Kaleb's internship with Enrique. I remember something from the second book (Vaughn's) when Nikita was researching Kaleb's past so she could decide whether he was a good ally or not - something about how Kaleb's level of psy power dropped after a swan changeling was killed. It would have been a anomaly enough for people to question/point it out except for the fact that he regained the power he had lost in a span of 3 months or something like that. I'm going based on memory, but the idea that a swan changeling might be involved has been stuck in my head since we first realized Kaleb was searching for someone.

Eva said...

I don´t think that Kaleb is looking for a changeling. I think she is Psy with a special ability when it comes to the NetMind. ... Something that could change Kaleb`s original plan (whatever that is). A F-Psy would e.g. fit into it.
Hm, the ability backsight could be e.g. unseful by learning how the Net had worked before silence.

Anonymous said...

After I finished reading ToN I`m absolutly convinced of two things:
First- the next book has to be about Kaleb (please, PLEASE let it be about Kaleb) and second- I will never survive the wait (more than a year, COME ON, it`s just not fair)!

Did anyone else get the strong feeling that Kaleb can`t be the Ghost? Vasic seems more and more likely, mhmm... But I guess there`s no way to find out right now, is there?
I also got the impression that the person Kaleb tracked down at the end was uplinked to the PsyNet. So shouldn`t it be another Psy? And stripped bare of her shields no less. That`s something that happens to F-Psy after their Silence fractures and why a close family member is trained to take over the job of putting shields in place... right? Maybe the theory about Faiths cousin (Sahara?) beeing the one Kaleb was hunting for wasn`t so far off the mark. Well, I`m only second language english, so I could have missed something (or a lot :D) ... I enjoyed the book anyway.

Thanks for such a wonderful read, Frau Singh!

Anonymous said...

I still think Kaleb is the ghost and I think Judd knows who the ghost really is. In KOS he told the ghost he did not want to be able to see his face so that he would not have any images in his mind that someone could find and use.

lia and shannan

I looked back into some of the other books and it did not actually say that the swan changeling died just that she went missing and that Kaleb's powers dropped for a month before becoming stronger again.

I think Enrique hid her and then was killed before he could finish his experiments. Kaleb probably knew how crazy he was since he was a witness to the experiments and never let on he like her.

I wonder if the is why Black Sea wants the alliance.

Anonymous said...

Kaleb is the Ghost and he is looking for Sahara. At least that is the way it seems that everything is pointing to. Loved the book. It is now one of my favorites. Love Hawke and Sienna moments the most. I think that we will see Riaz end Adria end up mated before this arc ends.

Karen Marie said...

I really enjoyed this book, but not as much as the rest of the series. I can not put my finger on what was wrong. Perhaps the romance was in the background - it's a bit unlike the other books. Over half of the book referred to other things. And there was a chiffhanger in the end, which does not really fit the rest of the series. Despite all this, this series is still my favorite - and I can not wait for the next book!

Gratings from Denmark :D

Anonymous said...

Hey thanks to everypne who has posted on about ToN as it doesnt come out in England for another week. Its amazing all the comments and I get the guist of the story. It seems amazing.

Erika said...
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lovehina154 said...

I haven't read the book yet. Is Alexei in it?

Erika said...

Yes he is. Pretty much every SnowDancer makes an appearance.

Also, when I mentioned the cat/wolf relationship, I should have said DarkRiver/SnowDancer since I'm hoping Jonquil (Tally and Clay's adopted son) is the guy in the relationship and he's technically not a cat.

Anonymous said...

Yes wondering who the cat / wolf are.

lia said...

You're right, Anon - I just checked the books. In CbI, Nikita is reading reports about Kaleb's psychic growth patterns and says that he showed "a sharp decline at age sixteen. That would have been a cause for severe concern, except that Kaleb had stabilized within the month... it had been noted down as a delayed adolescent reaction. Nikita had reason to disagree with that diagnosis... A changeling female -- a swan -- had disappeared seven days before Kaleb's logged decline. And the decline had begun approximately twenty-four hours after Kaleb returned from one of those unexplained absences..." (page 236 in my ebook)

Sorry for the long quote. Anyway, what I remember thinking is that Enrique was trying to train Kaleb in his sick experiments and something didn't go as planned. It doesn't say that she died, though we know that every other victim of Enrique's experiments (except Brenna) did, so I assume that was the end goal. Whether it was reached or not, or whether Kaleb somehow got her out and she went missing, or something of the sort... Or maybe Enrique realized that Kaleb was developing a bond with her, so he hid her away to use her against Kaleb later, I have no clue. I just think she is significant somehow.

RedButterfly said...
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lovehina154 said...

I'm probably the only one who didn't like Sienna.

As for the M/M F/F if an author J.R. Ward could do it and still have fans then Nalini Singh should be able to do it. They are her characters and she should be able to do with them whatever she feels.

sera said...

I hope in future books, we get to see Riaz and Adria develop a mating bond.

Anonymous said...

lovehina154,

I understand that an author can do what he/she wants with a book, but as we have been reading the series and all the books have MAIN heterosexual characters, it would be quite out of left field imo to have a full-length book with the main characters being the same sex.

I actually like M/M stories (not into F/F), but not for this series.

Arlia said...

Well, as for Aden/Vasic, I only mentioned it because my imagination ran away with me as well (along with a lot of other people, I'm reading). I mean, think about it. Wouldn't you love seeing two REALLY HOT guys together... as brothers. It just tugs at my heart... and other places. ;)

But, yeah. I can actually picture Kaleb's "her" as either Sahara or the Swan changeling. But didn't Faith foresee Sahara's death? I just don't see how she could be alive, especially as Anthony, who loves his children, wouldn't keep her mind locked and body isolated in such a harsh setting like that. And he's the one who told Faith that Sahara was death. So, he would know, right? That she's dead, I mean.
I think it's more possible that she's one of the changeling women that Enrique experimented on. Maybe one that no one would care about being missing, if she was in a corrupted pack or something. Since, I dunno, a lot of their bodies were found and identified by people who had loved them.
And I doubt Kaleb's "her" is a family relative, since he describes her pretty possessively. I know family members are close, but I don't think I've read passages in this series where, I dunno, Riley describes Brenna as "his". That just seems wrong to me.

I hope we found out what happened between Ben and Marlee. Maybe he was of an age that he found out she was his mate? I mean, Hawke found out pretty young, too. And they probably got into an argument about it.

Arlia said...

And I'm pretty sure Adria and Riaz will soon develop a mating bond in the next few books. After all, Hawke and Sienna were together (well, not as a couple, but still) for years before they finally mated. And so were Riley and Mercy.
Whereas Adria and Riaz had just met each other. So I think it's going to take some time for it to form.

Arlia said...

And didn't J. R. Ward just hint at the M/M relationship very heavily, and then pair them off with girls (I haven't read the series because of the pretty ridiculous names all the heroes have, but I have had my ear broken from all the complaints that my friends had about that--and the subsequent hating of the girls they were paired off with)?

Anonymous said...
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Acerogamma said...

I have one thing to say in this discussion -

I just hope that her next book is not another transition book. And I REALLY hope she stops torturing Adria and Riaz and just gives them the mate bond. Whatever point she was trying to make, she really didn't make it. It was not a feel good book, and it's not romantic when a guy still "feels a tug" towards someone else. That is called being emotionally unfaithful. It's implying that if Lissette's husband ever dies, Riaz will drop Adria for her. That is not love. Adria and Riaz deserve a happy ending.

Anonymous said...

Ok, so there has been many comments that Vasic or Kaleb is the Ghost. I think both are worng. Judd says he knows who it is but doesn't want to see their face in case someone tried to attack his shields. He knows Vasic's face because he worked with him as an arrow.
Kaleb is out because he has repeatedly said he has no interest in SanFran or SD unless they try to mess with him. In this last book, the Ghost is at Hawke and Sienna's Mating ceremony, although accidentally. It says he has been on SD territory before though never this deep, and he doesn't know why he is even watching.

At this point it mentions him remebering Sienna at age 15. The Ghost cannot be Vasic then, because (again in this book)Vasic remembers meeting Sienna when he was 18 and she a child (under Ming)not a teenager. So neither Vasic or Kaleb can be the Ghost...just doesn't compute in terms of numbers.

Anonymous said...

If Vasic met Sienna when she was 15 (and he considered her a child) and he was 18, that would make him 22 now. Wayyyy to young. Judd is about 32, right? and him and Aden and Vasic are in the same age group, right? Just doesn't fit.

MassGirl...

Eva said...

Hm... Was there a shock wave in the Net when Marshall died? - What dissapointed me was the fact, that it seemed so easy to kill this well experienced councilor who was holding his place so long. This fact bother me till today.

Anonymous said...

Arlia, I think you may have confused Sahara with Marine. Marine was Faith's half sister and she for saw her death. Sahara is Faith's cousin and it was never mentioned that Faith saw her death or anything else about her. All that was mentioned about Sahara was that she mysteriously went missing.

Anonymous said...
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Anonymous said...

I think Vasic may be the Ghost, too. In one of the books, I don't remember which one, Judd asked the Ghost if he cared about or was close to anyone and the Ghost said there was one person. Well, the only person that Vasic seems to be close to is Aden.

Anonymous said...
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Anonymous said...

really really want to know just who it was that kaleb found at the end, thats going to bug me till the next book comes out! personally i think he might be the ghost, it just seems to fit.

lovehina154 said...

I want to know who the next book is going to be about. I really hate waiting for things.

Anonymous said...
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Anonymous said...

I can see kalab as ghost; swan changeling fixation with the twist that she has psy genes and is also a high level J. How else do you get Dark mind and net mind their HEA? Also Anthony & Nikita were together late at night when the net collapsed & K popped in. Looks promising to me.

Tabitha said...

"At this point it mentions him remebering Sienna at age 15. The Ghost cannot be Vasic then, because (again in this book)Vasic remembers meeting Sienna when he was 18 and she a child (under Ming)not a teenager"

I had this conversation in another forum. Nalini referred to Tammy as a child in Beat of Temptation when she mated with Nate at 15. Hawke also referred to Sienna as a child and she defected at 16. It's safe to say "child" isn't a good indicator of Sienna's age in this series. Without knowing Vasic's age in ToN, he can't be ruled out either. If he is 22-24, then he is still a possibility.

I did wonder how Kaleb would have had contact with Sienna at 15, if he is the Ghost. I imagine Ming kept a short leash on her, so I figured the Ghost is an Arrow after the mating celebration scene. Another line, regarding routine sweeps, makes me think martial trained, like an Arrow.

After years of reading comments on the internet in every context, I'm never surprised what people will write under the guise of anonymity. I thinks it's fair to speculate of future relationships, which is what WAS going on here. Everything else is off topic and speaking as a fan, not interesting.

Anonymous said...

I agree 4:21

M/M is actually hot, but it is not for this series.
If I am used to reading a series with M/F hea's, and then all of a sudden, there is a book with M/M of course I'm going to get upset.

Anyways, back to the thread - I heard Nalini has only 2-3 books left planned for the arc, then after it will be other characters in the Psy/Changeling world, but not the same changelings or Psy? After all the characters that we met that I feel like need their hea, how can 3 books suffice??? :)

Arlia said...

Lol, okay, you know what, I'm sorry I mentioned it. It's probably never going to happen anyway. Besides, we don't need this post to devolve into a YouTube comment thread. :D

And I was thinking of Marine. That means there is a large possibility that "her" could be Sahara. Do you think Kaleb's book could be the next in the series (well, if he isn't the ghost)? I mean, it did leave off on a pretty big cliffhanger, one surrounding Kaleb. I think the Ghost's book will be the last in this ARC. But, who knows? Maybe the Ghost's book will be the catalyst for the PsyNet going down and then the next few books will deal with the aftermath.
I just know that one year is too long to wait, especially with a cliffhanger in the last book.

MassGirl said...

Hi Tabitha....You responded to my pot about Vasic and Kaleb not being the Ghost. Thanks.

Still...In terms of age and child...Nate was 25 when he and Tammy mated so he would have seen her as a child. Hawke was 30, right? So he would have seen a 16 yr old Sienna as a child. 18 is closer to 15, even though Psy reach adulthood at 16-18, right? I still think Vasic would be too young.

However, thinking it over, the NetMind did show Faith the thread that leads to the Ghost. She understood that if he broke, then the Net would fall. Vasic tried to hold that one section when the Anchor was murdered. Kaleb saved them;Dual Cardinal was such a surprise-I loved it. Also, Kaleb has tried to catch the Ghost but he keeps missing.

I, too, believe it's another Arrow with Martial power. Could it be Abbot. He also wants peace, and it hasn't been said what his designation is. Both Vasic and Aden are monitoring him.

Thanks,
MassGirl

Tabitha said...

MassGirl, Referring to the age, I think that is Nalini description, not so much the characters. Changelings would normally refer to that age as Juveniles.

That hint about Vasic's other ability is intriguing along with Kaleb's dual cardinal status. I think any powerful Psy could be destructive to the Net. Judd and Nikita come to mind. Both aren't Cardinals but badass none-the-less. Sienna is the only Cardinal Arrow we read about and she is an X. Vasic wouldn't be an Arrow unless he has some major martial skill, and teleporting wouldn't be enough

Jill McKenna said...

I think the GHOST may be one of the original founding arrows??? I want more of everyone!!! Vasic, Hawke/Sienna, Aden, Kaleb, Nikita, Alice...OMG DO I LOVE this series. And who is "HER"???

MassGirl said...

I think I've developed an afinity towards the Arrows. lol! I love that Vasic is this almost-on-the-edge-but-could-be-saved personality. I truely believe he needs a submissive with spine. I love that Aden is like his brother-conscience, and that he has this slightly mysterious power that Kaleb is almost catching on to but that Walker had helped him to hide. I like that Abbot loves the beach even if he doesn't know it and he watches what the other races do with longing in his eyes.

Needless to say the Arrows that defected have touched me.

LOVE LOVE JUDD. Walker is a STUD! even if he wasn't an Arrow, he taught them, that says something about how the Arrow School saw him.

I love the mysterious protectors.

Anonymous said...

hy everyone :)
First of all I would like to apologise for my grammar because english is not my first (or even second) language so forgive me if I write something wrong.
After reading almost every comment that is posted here, I'd made my own conclusions about Kaleb and the misterious "her". I think it's someone Enrique tortured and Kaleb was forced to watch it. I also think that Kaleb wants to use her ( her mind or something she knows) in his advantage to gain control over the Net. Because that is he's main purpose/intent. He is said it repeatedly.
I do not think that Kaleb's book will be the next. Nalini Singh like's to keep us on tenterhooks (don't know if its a correct phrase). Kaleb's book will be the last on the series.
After reading ToN, I also don't think that Kaleb is the Gost anymore. More likely it's Vasic.
About Riaz and Adria - that didn't interest me very much. I was more captivated by the other storylines at that book. (specifically Kaleb, Vasic and Aden, and even Sienna and Hawke).
The comments about M/M and F/F - I don't think that would be my cup of tea. I personally got nothing agaist that sort of thing, but to read about it in my favorite book series would be a bit awkward. So please N. Singh the main storyline should be M/F.
OK thats all for now.
Take care,
greeting from Estonia.

Jill McKenna said...
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Anonymous said...

I was sad that Riaz and Adria did not have the mating bond and was wondering how that could possibly work, then Nalini gave the scene of the old human couple in the park, and that just cinched it for me. They were clearly bonded, but they weren't changeling, so is that love less than what could be if they were changeling? OF COURSE NOT!!!

Kaleb is not the Ghost. I'm leaning towards Vasic.

Faith's hysterics made me burst out laughing. Mercy/Riley are having MULTIPLES!!!

Judd has a fan club!!! I want one of those "Judd is My Boyfriend" pins.

Anonymous said...

I can't say that I absolutely loved this book, it felt like a bridge/transitional book to a deeper story further along...I really didn't have an investment Riaz and Adria as a couple but I wonder if this is set up for Riaz's bondmate to die in the war and then the mating bond will transfer to Adria. I liked the back stories better, Nalini gave us insight to the workings of the Snowdancer pack and I believe maybe a further integration of all packs after the war.
As for the Ghost, I don't believe it is either Vasic or Kaleb, maybe an Arrow we haven't met yet or as suggested further up the thread Abbott. I like the theory that it is Sahara Nightstar that is Kaleb's Her. I wonder if Tatiana might have something to do with her shields and working with Ming, the traps in around her mind...what better way to have future insight then your own captive F-psy and Tatiana did move up ranks very quickly. I also think that this her will be an opposite double of Kaleb his affinity with Dark Mind hers will be with Net Mind and maybe she would be a double cardinal only hers being an E. This book gave us lots of interesting scenarios to ponder...oh well hopefully it won't take a whole year to wait and Nalini has said she is writing a p/c novella so maybe not so long.

Anonymous said...

I just wanted to throw something on here that nobody's mentioned yet. Remember how, after Kaleb went to talk to Nikita and Anthony, he teleported to a room where Tatiana and Ming both were, and talked to them? WHAT IS GOING ON?! :D Actually I'm not that surprised, because Kaleb is sneaky. And I remember in one of his scenes, Kaleb thought about how he has to kill Tatiana, Ming, and Shoshanna eventually. Which I'm perfectly fine with, I'm glad Henry's dead and I want the other three evil Councilors to die too. This series has made me bloodthirsty, I guess. :) But anyway, I wonder what Kaleb's agenda is. Is he just pretending to be on everyone's side while it suits him? I adore him and want him to have a book and a HEA, but he's so hard to figure out sometimes!

-Sarah M.

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Anonymous said...

Hi,
I also think that Kaleb`s mysterious "she" is Sahara NightStar and that she has been imprisoned deep in the net and many telepathic shields by Shoshanna. In one book was mentioned, that Henry wanted to check, if his "wife" Shoshanna had her personal "pet F-Psy".
Maybe Shoshanna broke Saharas shields to get more dark visions through.

Anonymous said...

I loved to see so much of Hawke and Sienna and I can't wait to get to see more of them. I absolutely love them.

Unknown said...

I could go on reading about Hawke and Sienna. They continue to be the top draw for me!

Wednesday said...

What I ended up wondering about is the purpose of the mating bond. If it's not universal among changelings, and it can be refused by changelings who experience it, what's the point of it? Why does it happen to some and not to others? Nothing Riaz said or did seemed to imply any consequence as a result of him choosing Adria over Lisette. Can non-bonded changeling pairs have pupcubs?

I felt bad for Adria feeling like a second choice, and the more I read about how much Riaz's wolf liked hers, the more puzzled I was about why the mating bond wouldn't happen between them. I still hope it kicks in, but I'm even more curious about why it would at that point. Can it even happen while Lisette is still alive? From the way Hawke was carrying on in Kiss, it sounds a lot more like only one potential bond can exist at a time.

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Barb L from Canada said...

As entertaining and provocative as some of the comments were, I agree with the previous post. This is about the fictional story written by a very talented author. This is FANTASY!! and none of us would be reading this type of book if we didn't enjoy the unlimited possibilities available in this kind of story. Enough said on that topic.
So what did I think of ToN? I liked it very much, because it gave hope to those changelings who were not blessed with a mating bond. It has been mentioned in previous books that couples in long term relationships do have children. It has also been mentioned that though finding your mate is wonderful, it isn't that common. I think we were spoiled because with the previous books, in order for the psy part of the couple to survive, the link to the psynet had to be replaced with another link - i.e. the mating bond, or those couples would not have survived.
If you actually look at the mated couples that are only changeling you get Tammy/Nate, Indigo/Drew, Tarah/Abel, Jess/Joe, Kyllie/Cian - there are number of changeling/human couples that have appeared as well, Annie/Zach, Talin/Clay, D'Arn/Sue Ling, Yuki/Elias, Ria/Emmet. I'm sure there are more just can't think of them at the moment. If you also include the information we have been given that both Snow Dancer and Dark River are VERY large packs, no exact numbers given, then the mating bond isn't rare but it isn't common either.
The bond is cherished because it allows the couple the freedom to "know" what their partner is feeling, not thinking, and this helps them support each other. But it doesn't ensure a stress free or smooth partnership. Just think of all the disagreements Sasha and Luke had, or the fact that Drew had to put "cute bears" in Indigo's car as a way to apologize.
Tangle of Need was the 11th book in this series, and it was about two changelings who found love. We were treated to glimpses of other favourite characters and what is going on in their lives and how the past events have affected them. This book also gave us more glimpses into the Arrows and many of their secrets, I agree with others that the Ghost is likely an Arrow, but I think if its not Zaid, then perhaps a child of his who now sees that Silence isn't the saviour it was proposed to be, and instead of saving the Psy it is now destroying them, just a thought. As to who "Her" is haven't a clue, though it would be interesting if it did turn out to Faith's cousin Sahara. Or it could be Kaleb's twin, I like that possibility as well.
For those of you who may be interested, the couples breakdown as follows:
Psy/Changeling - 5 books (StS, VoH, CbI, HtP, KoS)
Psy/Forgotten - 1 book (BoM)
Psy/Human - 1 book (BoJ)
Human/Changeling - 1 book (MtP)
Changeling/Changeling - 3 books (BbF, PoP, ToN)
of the 11 couples, 8 have a mating bond, the other 3 are partners who love each other.
Well, that's my 2 cents worth, I am just thankful that Nalini keeps writing such wonderful books and that I can read them again & again & again......

Anonymous said...

i t think the 'she' kaleb is looking for is sahara, and if not whomever she is, she is not a relative because this series is always talking about two main character who fell in love with each other. if the next book or any coming book was about kaleb, it means he is the main character and the co-star should be someone he form some kind of emotional bond with that is as far as possible from being blood relative .

Nalini Singh said...

Hi all - obviously, as I'm traveling, I've only just been alerted to what's happening in the comments on this post.

If you'll see what I wrote in my post, I asked you all to be polite and respectful to one another.

If you disagree, then just agree to disagree. Use of any kind of insults or emotive/inflammatory language meant to hurt others, will not be tolerated under any circumstances. This blog is meant to be a safe place for all readers.

Let's just consider the subject under contention closed. I'm seriously considering going back and deleting all the inappropriate comments - there is no place for that kind of tone here. Anything that comes in on the subject after my comment will DEFINITELY be deleted.

I really don't want to shut down this thread, or put comments on moderation as that will seriously slow down the flow of conversation, but if this continues, I'll have no other choice.

Okay, taking off my strict hat - I hope you continue to enjoy discussing TANGLE OF NEED.

Anonymous said...

I like your thinking...Marshall as the Ghost...that is something our sneaky brilliant Nalini Singh would throw at us unsuspecting readers!

Anonymous said...

Never considered Shoshanna...interesting.

Anonymous said...

Actually the mating bond is described as "not uncommon" and based on what we've seen that would make sense.

I hope Riaz and Adria are able to mate down the road as them not having the bond did reduce my enjoyment of the book. I don't like the idea of Riaz still feeling that pull towards Lisette even if it is muted and emotionally he now thinks of her just as a cherished friend.

Always V said...

I have tons to say before I began to read everyone else' POVS <3 Now I only need to repeat HOW CRAZY IN LOVE I AM WITH THE BOOK.

Thnx so much, Nalini :give_rose: You're unbelievable!!! I've been depressed after much disappointment from another book. Now my world has turned right again. Sienna has always owned me. She's so perfect for Hawke. So yeah . . . more of them is such a huge bonus. She's old yet so very young. Breaking my heart when she believes she will never have a child of her own. Cuz she doesn't want to pass on her evil mutated X gene to the next generation.

You've spent time on Riaz & Adria. LOL So much more then I've expected. Never thought you would've written their back stories in such full detail like that. Never expected to revisit Martin. Never expected to see Lizette & Riaz together. The best part? When Riaz declared he was in love with her. YEAH!!! The mating bond has to wilt & die at that moment!! Coolest! LOL

My apology to Martin cuz I did think of him as a loser in Play of Passion :( Sorry. He couldn't help being who he was.

There's one aspect of the new development that no one seems to have any problem with. BUT I DO! LOL

How is it going to work out when someone mates with a member of the Black Sea???

Sienna pets her alpha wolf.
Sascha pets her black panther.
Indigo & Drew <3 two wolves playing.
The best pair yet. . . Riley's wolf nuzzles his leopard Mercy.

How is anyone going to .... eeek... get romantic with an octopus? Or a sea eel? Or . . . need I say more?
And it will smell. Fishy LOL maybe?

There's this one scene from Kiss of Snow :)
Maybe no one noticed. I love it.

Quote from Kiss of Snow, PP. 175-176

Hawke pressed his lips to Ines's temple when she put down the bottle. "It was bad," he said, ignoring Simran's scowl, "but I had her and I wasn't letting go."

"I'm so glad ypu're a stubborn bast***." Ines's thin arms hugged him tight before she leaned over to brush the hair off Simran's face with fingers that were exquisitely tender."

End Quote

Nalini: You Rock!!!!

Love is Love is Love.

Always V said...

EDIT:

SORRY :(

I DROPPED THE WORD

NOT

Raiz delclared HE WAS NOT IN LOVE WITH LIZETTE.

lovehina154 said...

Could someone recommend good authors like Nalini Singh that has characters of different races, and diversity, and ethinicties?

Anonymous said...

@Lovehina154-Christine Feehan has a few gd series u'd love if u like Nalini Singh- Specifically Dark Series. Also Sherrilyn Kenyon has a few gd series that are amazing.

lisa scar said...

Put another one in the Team Disappointed crowd regarding Riaz and Adria. Two dominants settling for someone who is not their mate, did not feel right or stay true to the series.

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